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United Police States of Obama

Z

Zakis

War Priestess
First off let me say I never used to get into this political shit. My view was and still is that the government itself as well as banking and corporations need to be torn down by the people and rebuilt from scratch. The corruption and greed must be washed away. Anyway I usually refused to talk politics or religion because it lead to ugly arguements or the people I tried to have a legitimate discussion with were so narrow-minded on one view that it turned into a cluster-fuck.

Second, I am not going to spend any amount of time sitting here gathering links to sources for anybody, mainly because I could give a fuck. If you got here and you are on the internet, you should be able to find sources concerning Obama and his wonderful resume of socialism.

Third, I hate Obama, but don't confuse this with I love everyone else. Politicians by definition are the scum of the earth. As much as one day I would love to see someone come along resembling a few of our previous respectable presidents I think those times are over.

Anyway lets see...16 trillion dollars in debt, sequestering(austerity), Stunning record of jobs overseas, higher taxes, streamlining immigration(really?), NDAA act, gun bans, drones in American skies, election rigging, and Obama's disturbing statements concerning Congress' unwillingness to work with him. I didn't start to really get involved in this until the CISPA/SOPA and its attempts to infringe on people on the internet as well as the more recent cybersecurity bill Dictator Obama has been pushing allowing corporations and government more leeway in poking through what they please on the internet, in the name of security!!!! Funny that comes up a lot from him as well as from the government in general. Its for your security, like the Patriot Act(another disaster which flew into existence after the terrorist?/government assisted? destruction of the twin towers).

So we have things like that and oddly enough, very convenient events used to push agendas. Anyway so if you are uninformed you now have states/feds attempting to trample all over your constitutional rights(especially the 2nd amendment), you can be detained without a trial indefinitely by your own government(thanks NDAA!!), and American drones will be coming to a city near YOU! Also if you hadn't read up on ammo sales lately, the Department of Homeland Security has recently made HUGE ammo purchases and now supposedly has enough ammo to wage a 30 YEAR ground war. The Social Security Administration bought 174,000 rounds of that 40. cal ammo. Why the fuck does the DHS and other agencies(some of them with nothing to do with national security) need all this ammo? Someone please tell me why? I would actually really love a straight answer.

Anyway, come and try to take my guns. Just try. Now I could go on about my views on immigration and what not but I will close with this. If you sit there and let the government take away your guns, then there is nothing protecting you from your government.
 
Ok, we're going to be at odds, but this is a rant, so fuck it...

What the hell makes you think you're so special that you need guns to make the government accountable? Newsflash...countries WITHOUT access to assault rifles are doing just fine, thank you very much. Their governments haven't suddenly decided to take away free speech or rescind democratic rights just because angry civilians don't have. Russians can legally buy guns and the seem to be doing just fine with El-presidente Putin.

Seriously, doesn't shit like this suggest something is out of whack in your country?
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Now I don't pretend to know what the answer is, there's going to be a combination of social and other factors, but looking at the data, it suggests your country can't handle their guns responsibly. Perhaps the government should stop you killing yourselves with 'em?

Or maybe you have another interpretation of this data? I'm open to convincing.
 
I personally believe in an American's right to own guns and protect themselves with them. I think one of the factors that contribute to such a high gun related death rate is the idea that is ingrained in the American psyche that states anyone can make it to the top. Many people believe (wrongly) that they can be the best. Someone has to make the fries and most Americans believe it is beneath them. Another thing that contributes to this is many Americans feel pretty entitled and don't want to work for greatness. Add a quick way to make lots of money (drugs) and you have a perfect storm of people who feel entitled to riches the easy way and are willing to justify taking other people's lives to protect that.

What I am saying is that I believe the majority of gun related deaths in America are also drug related. I think drug sales are so inflated in this country because of many Americans sense of entitlement and belief in the ability of anyone to go from nothing to a star. I think its more a matter of not being willing to work hard and taking shortcuts that lead to people being willing to use guns and then the unthinkable happens.
 


Once again, it is NOT Obama in my opinion that is causing this. Put a republican in the seat he has and give him the time Obama had and nothing would have been done either.

People blame the President but they forget to hold the house and the congress and the governers and the representatives and the "supporters" who back peoples "views" with their "wallets". Look at the system.
 
I am at work and on my phone so this post wont be long. Like I said most politicians are scumbags, yet Obama has made it his mission to infringe on the constitution.

In response to Dire's post besides it being part of our constitution and considered an inalienable right, I dont trust the government of this or any other country really, especially ours. I find it great that you and others feel comfortable with their country's leadership though.

I can tell you exactly what gun violence is caused by though. Historical immigration and drug trade as well as our country's continued views on mental health programs. I can attest to all of these things from a front line perspective due to my profession. Our country refuses to properly address the lack of mental health infrastructure or the ridiculous drug problems. Instead Obama decides we dont need the constitution and immigration needs to be easier. As if we dont already have a gajillion illegals pouring over the border every day. I might post more on my personal experiences when I am not trying to type this on my phone
 
I agree with some of your sentiments, but placing the blame on Obama for all of our ills is too simplistic.

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• Obama is not a socialist. He is a center-right technocrat, and the most conservative Democratic president since Truman. His detractors paint him as far left (socialist/communist) or far right (fascist/fundamentalist Muslim), often both in the same sentence, but neither are anything more than hyperbole.

• Obama is not responsible for the lion's share of the debt. You can thank his predecessor and over a decade of war for eradicating the Clinton surplus and deepening it several times over. In fact, Obama has attenuated spending increases to the slowest pace in sixty years. Extremely difficult to do given the lingering effects of Bush's programs and the obstructionism of Republican legislators.

• Which brings me to another point: the primary source of our government's incompetence, particularly the turd sandwich that is sequestration, is Republican brinkmanship. They refused to raise the debt ceiling because they don't understand how it works (it's not a license to increase spending, but rather allows us to pay off debts we've already accrued, and defaulting on our loans is really really really bad), needlessly damaging our economy and shifting the burden of that damage onto you and me. The terms of the sequester were put in place to force them to act like adults and actually govern, but they can't even do that when staring down the barrel of impending political suicide. This is because...

• As conservative as the Republican party has become in recent years (i.e. batshit-ly so), they're nothing compared to the insurgent wing of their party that is so steeped in radical paleoconservatism masquerading as populist libertarianism and so obsessed with ideological purity that it is inherently impossible for them to govern. House Speaker John Boehner tried to get them to support a (terrible) alternative to the sequester, but couldn't get an ounce of cooperation from them. After failing to get his own party to stop being petulant children, he famously said "God only knows" what would happen next. If your taxes went up, thank the Tea Party.

This obstructionism led the 112th Congress to pass fewer bills than ever, fewer even than Truman's "Do-Nothing Congress." Even ideas that conservatives came up with, like Cap-&-Trade and the individual mandate, became anathema as soon as the secret Kenyan Muslim put his support behind them. Senate Republicans force a filibuster for anything more controversial than naming a post office, and the GOP controls the House because of aggressive gerrymandering and voter disenfranchisement at the state level. Establishment Republicans cultivated an environment that allowed radically conservative candidates to thrive, and now that they're in power, they refuse to do their jobs. The party has created a monster that's beyond their control.

• Gun control does not mean taking your guns away. It's an attempt to make it more difficult for criminals to acquire guns. Whether they will do this effectively or rationally remains to be seen. Right now, there is startlingly little oversight over who can purchase guns. The ATF hasn't had an official director in six years, and its regulatory power has been systematically eviscerated by collusion between the gun lobby and Congress. Over half of all illegally acquired guns can be traced to 1% of dealers, but it's almost impossible to prosecute them. Assault weapons bans are often pointless and grounded in emotional reactions to high-profile mass shootings, as most incidents of gun violence are handgun homicides with few victims. Expanded access to mental health care is one of the major initiatives of his proposed (and probably doomed) program. I'm not taken in by weepy "For the children" arguments, but gun violence in the U.S. dwarfs that of other developed nations. There is clearly a problem. Do I trust this administration to have the wherewithal to address it properly? Umm...

• I notice several hints that you may believe some... less than factual things. For example, the thoroughly discredited idea that the government was responsible for the World Trade Center attacks, or the mention elsewhere that Sandy Hook may have been a "false flag" event, i.e. staged by the government as an excuse to limit our rights. It's okay to maintain a healthy degree of skepticism and be hesitant to accept the official explanation for such things at face value, but inconsistencies in these accounts do not give you license to invent a new explanation based on tenuous or nonexistent evidence. Open-mindedness does not mean giving equal credence to every claim that you encounter. Subject new ideas to rigorous scrutiny and compare their compatibility to already-established truths. If they withstand reasonable doubt, only then should you accept them, while still being prepared to discard them if they're later falsified.

By all means, distrust the government. Condemn Obama for his myriad failures: clinging to Bush's expansion of executive privilege, failing to close Guantanamo, slaughtering civilians in highly inaccurate drone attacks, or my own pet peeve of terminating the Yucca Mountain project and potentially crippling the nuclear power industry. I see a lot of hatred for Obama from people online, and almost all of it is for unfounded or inchoate reasons. I've been hesitant to confront you on this because I know we have deep disagreements and I like to keep things peaceful around here. I just hope that your dissatisfaction with the status quo takes on a more productive form.
 


this is how im doing this, deal.

Oh and instead of blame games what about accountability:

 
I actually like your post Red. I am just not clear enough on my views. I dislike Obama for a lot of his work but I have a general distaste for politics. I don't think any of them are worth much.

I have to disagree with you on a few points. While there are some great ideas in possible gun reform concerning acquiring a gun through normal channels that won't stop criminals from getting them. I haven't seen any news of the federal bills going forward but I will point out my fantastic new state law as an example of my unease. In New York State Dictate...ahem...Presidential candidate....excuse me Governor Cuomo..according to news reports I've seen pretty much locked down the politicians in a late night session to pass a magazine restriction law. He did this so fast as some sort of "hey look at me I can get shit done act" that he limited the law abiding citizens ability to protect themselves AND totally 'forgot' to write in a provision exempting law enforcement. The law restricts all magazines to SEVEN round capacity. There are multiple situations including body armor and the influence of LSD that would enable someone to withstand a clip of that size and keep attacking me or my fellow officer or civilians. Its just this kind of brazen arrogance displayed by Cuomo and Obama that I completely distrust and the supposed knowledge they claim to have concerning what's best for me or my fellow man. I guess that can be applied to most politicians though.

The law is slated to go into effect in March which would effectively brand not only law abiding citizens but thousands of active and retired law enforcement officers....yeah those people you pay to enforce the laws you idiots write. Brilliant!

As for believing that all is not what it seems with certain events I didn't intend to come across as believing every other theory that comes along. I think I might come across too overbearing regarding that due to the extremely narrow-minded views of my family members and some friends. I had actually planned to post another short rant concerning people being labeled nuts or conspiracy theorists just for thinking outside the box sometimes. I trust few and question everything.

Anyway this all being said I will let everyone else debate things and excuse myself from posting in this thread again. There is a reason I avoided even discussing religion and politics until a year or two ago. Its interesting to listen to others viewpoints but I find it tiresome and not something I wish to do when I get home from jail every day. I only posted it because Trist thought I had some unique views and wanted to start a good debate. Mission Accomplished. I will continue to read everyone's posts though and I appreciate everyone's civilized posts even if mine wasn't lol.
 
Baldoraxx said:
All i want to say is go watch Obama2016
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Dinesh D'Souza is an intellectually bankrupt ideologue. 2016: Obama's America is exactly the sort of speculative hyperbole that's poisoning mainstream media and making rational discussion impossible. The core ethos of the movie is that Obama is secretly a Marxist and will enact his radical leftist agenda now that he's elected to a second term. As I said above, if he's a Marxist, he's a really bad one, and he used his four years of power to cave to conservatives and pursue centrist policies. Calling him socialist, Marxist, or communist strips those words of their meaning. If supporting Social Security and Medicare makes you a socialist, then we're all socialists.

There is no evidence of anything concrete in the documentary. The views of Obama's relatives, especially ones with whom he had little to no contact, are meaningless; Ronald Reagan's own son is a liberal atheist. D'Souza is spinning a story out of ether. He simply perpetuates the narrative that Obama is "not like us" (dog-whistle racist code for "black") and uses his ethnic heritage to evoke fear in traditionalist conservatives. It's a craven tactic that should be treated with the utmost contempt.

Other people saying things: here, here, and here.
 
you will have your opinion and we will have our own. Obama needs to be impeached and thats all there is to it :) He is tearing apart this country little by little.

Obama 2016 go watch it now.

Haha If you think he is in the office to protect your rights then you are wrong.

I will leave it as Obama is a freaking idiot :) Enjoy
 
There is so much stupid in the original post I don't know where to begin.

So let me get this straight, you hate Obama because of austerity (decrease of spending), higher taxes (increase of revenue) and debt (spending is greater than revenue). Can we just all pause for a moment and think about that? If all three of these make you angry than there is literally nothing Obama can do that won't piss you off. Because he cant decrease the debt without either decreasing more spending (increasing austerity) or increasing revenue (increasing taxes)

Nothing outside of the republican-castrated medical plan that even closely resembles Socialism. Go read a history book for some actual perspective.

Next, election rigging? Excuse me? You can't through that major accusation out there without any explanation or data. What are you talking about.

And Obama is a dictator because... he does things you don't like... And increases government power. Sorry, nope, still not a dictator. A dictator is someone rules without opposition. So I guess you're completely forgetting the congress and supreme court.

And ah, the 2nd amendment. Let's have a look what it says. "A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed, Lets take this in chunks. "A WELL REGULATED" OH MY GOD! How dare DICTATOR OBAMA trample on our second amendment with his REGULATIONS. oops. sorry. no. that's allowed in the first three words of the amendment. Next, "Militia". Wait? Guns are for a regulated militia? Well shit, seems like these guns are only guaranteed for the purposes of civil service? I guess that was conveniently forgotten... next. "being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed." Ok yeah only one interesting point, for the last chunk. It says arms. Not guns, arms. Arms are short firearms. What firearms did they have in the time of the constitution? Muskets? How many people per minute could you kill with a musket? One if you're incredibly fast? What about with today's modern weaponry? Thirty? A hundred?... but no, you're right, the bill of rights can never be altered even in the face of such an overwhelming change in technology. Lets just ignore that one man today can have more firepower than 30 men in the time of the constitution.

The government is of the people. If you don't like something go out and vote. Don't make paranoid threats. And its disrespectful to democracy to call elected officials in a system of checks and balances dictators. If you think this is a dictatorship, you couldn't fathom a real one.
 
Baldoraxx said:
you will have your opinion and we will have our own. Obama needs to be impeached and thats all there is to it :) He is tearing apart this country little by little.

Obama 2016 go watch it now.

Haha If you think he is in the office to protect your rights then you are wrong.

I will leave it as Obama is a freaking idiot :) Enjoy
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We're entitled to our own opinions, but not our own facts. D'Souza invents things out of whole cloth and should be chastised for it.

If anyone is tearing the country apart, it's increasingly radical Republicans and their media arm, pulling sentiment to the right and refusing to compromise.

I never expressed a word of praise for Obama, and I certainly don't trust him or any of our "leaders" to protect my rights. But when people attack him for specious reasons (that, ironically, distract from legitimate problems that he should be held accountable for), I will do what I can to set the record straight. Please don't put words in my mouth.
 
Red Omen said:
If anyone is tearing the country apart, it's increasingly radical Republicans and their media arm, pulling sentiment to the right and refusing to compromise.
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Get the facts right. Its Obama who isn't willing to work with anyone.
 
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